History and Rumors

There is history, and there are rumors.  We hear a lot of rumors about what solstice is, even very old rumors from history, and whether Jesus' birth was then.

What are some things you've heard about when Jesus was born?

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When was Jesus really born?

The Bible doesn't say directly, so we have to look at the surrounding calendar events that are mentioned.  Jesus was probably conceived (not born) around November-December, during Kislev on the Hebrew Calendar, because Jesus was conceived six months after John the Baptist (Luke 1:24-26)—John's Father Zaccharias was a member of the course of Abijah, so his term would have ended in Sivan.  John was born  so Jesus would've been born six months later in Tishri (around September-October depending on  year).  This is near Jewish newyear (Rosh Hashanah) and the Feast of Booths. (Scheifler)

History and Rumors: Why do you think Christmas was created?

Don't answer too quickly, because if you think you know, you might begin to answer by saying "The Church created Christmas because...." and you already may be wrong.  Let's define terms first.

There are two churches: the visible church and the invisible church.  Much like how in the Tanakh there were Israelites and then there was a small remnant who were actually following God, the term “Church,” even in Biblical prophecy, may refer to the broader visible church.  Unfortunately, the Church of history doesn't always reflect following Jesus.

This can get frustrating, like we are the only ones telling the truth, and we want to just give in and say anyone who says they are a Christian is one.
Why does God let this happen?

Origin of the term Christmas:
Ancient Germanic (white) people used to worship Thor, the thunder god.  When the visible church took over the area, St. Boniface cut down Thor's tree to symbolize the spirit's defeat.  Then people were advised to bring trees into their homes on solstice to symbolize making Christ the center of their homes.  A church holiday was created called Christ Mass (Christmas).  They believed in transubstantiation, which is why they use the term mass.



The true meaning of Christmas is to have a Thor tree and Yule gift-giving feast and say it's a Jesus tree and Jesus gift-giving feast.

It is important to answer the following questions separately, because even if the answer is "no" for one it may not be "no" for both.

• Perhaps if it isn't associated with Thor and Yule by our society like it was then.  But, there are many self-proclaimed pagans who at least practice Yule, so you may have to at least explain that you know it's not really a Christian holiday since we took it from them, and that you practice it but that you don't draw any spiritual power from it.
• Don't look down on Christians who don't believe in Christmas. Those people might give even when there is not pressure to give, so don't call them “Scrooge”.
• My personal belief is that it is okay to practice, but I wouldn't do a tree if it were up to me.

Something to think about:

        When a person is the head of the church instead of Christ being the head of the Church, it doesn't matter whether you think something is ok.  It will be done no matter what.  That's what was done by the church with the Ancient Germanic (white) people.

Saint Nicholas was is a legendary figure who purportedly put money down chimneys of poor people.  Not much else is known about him.  Later, he was made the patron saint of harbour towns and called, “The Lord of the Sea.”  The modern myth is so different from the man, and gains so much information from other sources that this begs the question:

("Saint Nicholas") 270-346 A.D	("Sinterklaas") 2007 A.D

Santa Claus may be the story of another spirit if not is not simply made up as it went along, which of course is also possible.

Praying to the “The Lord of the Sea”, is probably praying to another spirit, such as Poseidon.

Something to think about: How much power is it accurate or appropriate to attribute to Nicholas, or Santa Claus, even if you are just telling your children the story for fun (or to control their behavior), especially if they believe it is real?

How is Jesus different from Santa Claus?

The Jesus of History is the same as the Jesus of the Bible, therefore we can trust the Bible more than we can trust the story of Santa Claus. (more)

• Maybe during Christmas we can share that we believe Jesus is Messiah, but also share that forcing people to change their actions is not the way to lead them to Christ.
• Maybe it is best tell children that Santa Claus is a just game that some people play on Christmas.  If you lie to them about Santa Claus, maybe they'll think you're lying to them about whether you really believe in Jesus.

Something to think about: What will your decision be about what you believe, do, and say about Christmas?

(Someone in the discussion mentioned the first part of Titus 1:15 "To the pure, all things are pure" [NASB].)

In response to Titus 1:15, the context shows that verse 15 doesn't mean everything you do or believe is justified--in fact the opposite is true. What you do and believe reflects what is already inside. Regarding God's justification of us, that works on a different level but yes it is still important: if we confront lies in our minds with truth then believe the right things our actions may change, but the spirits of those who is truly born again are pure even if we cross the line from lack of knowledge.

    If you are telling a person stories that affect your life and inspire you, and the story turns out to be about some other spirit, make sure that the person knows what stories are from another spirit, and knows that you don't follow that spirit and why.

    Make sure that you do not honor the Spirit of Solstice by giving honor to it's rituals and stories—make sure that you don't put in a place of honor the facts and rituals that are part of it's life but not part of Jesus' life.

Part 1 | Part 2

Sources Cited